Two articles I recommend for the readers of this forum:

Ukraine and the Internet Rumor Mill
"Fla Mill". Avian Flue Diary. 14 November 2009.

WHO, swine flu in the Ukraine and bin Laden's beard.
"Revere." Effect Measure. 16 November 2009.

Yes, I suspect that in the big scheme of things this Ukrainian flu really is a non-issue so far. Come to think of it, the "lungs black as charcoal" may be correct - but many Ukrainian adults smoke heavily. So not exactly worrying.

Still far too few fatal cases to take this outbreak seriously.
It is within usual loses from seasonal flu.
Ukrainians are also known to attempt treatment of many diseases with a bottle of vodka.
Their bodies may well not take it very kind, particularly if they are already suffering from a fever of 104+*F.

There just something fishy about this swine flu outbreak in Ukraine.

The amount of people infected, location of the outbreak, the black lungs and the outbreak happening just after Russia and Belarus hosted a joint military exercise.

I surprised no one has investigated this Baxter International lead. I presume Russia will do tests on the actual vaccine.

Is it a rouse to get NATO forces into the country?

Will you be getting a swine flu vaccine if they have it Anatoly ?

From the Daily Mail, British scientists testing Ukrainian 'super flu' that has killed 189 people, "lungs black as charcoal"

British scientists are examining the strain of swine flu behind a deadly Ukrainian outbreak to see if the virus has mutated.
A total of 189 people have died and more than one million have been infected in the country.
Some doctors have likened the symptoms to those seen in many of the victims of the Spanish flu which caused millions of deaths world-wide after the World War One.
An unnamed doctor in western Ukraine told of the alarming effects of the virus.
He said: 'We have carried out post mortems on two victims and found their lungs are as black as charcoal.
'They look like they have been burned. It's terrifying.'
Neighbouring Poland has called on the EU to take action, fearing the mystery virus may spread westwards.
Prime Minister Donald Tusk has written to European Commission President Jose Manuel Barroso and the Swedish Prime Minister, Fredrik Reinfeldt, who holds the EU presidency.
The letter said: 'The character of this threat demands that rapid action be undertaken at the European Union level.'
Russia, Slovakia, Poland, Hungary and Romania have already launched health checks on Ukrainians entering their territory.
Slovakia has closed two of five border crossings.
Ukrainian President Viktor Yushchenko has called in the World Health Organisation.
A team of specialists are carrying out tests in Kiev and Lviv in an effort to identify the virus.
President Yushchenko said: 'People are dying. The epidemic is killing doctors. This is absolutely inconceivable in the 21st Century.'
In a TV interview, the President added: 'Unlike similar epidemics in other countries, three causes of serious viral infections came together simultaneously in Ukraine: two seasonal flus and the Californian flu.
'Virologists conclude that this combination of infections may produce an even more aggressive new virus as a result of mutation.'
Four men and one woman have died from the flu in Lviv, said emergency hospital chief doctor Myron Borysevych.
Two of the dead patients were in the 22-35 age group, with two others over 60.
He diagnosed the disease as viral pneumonia.
'We have sent the analyses to Kiev. We don't believe it's H1N1 swine flu. Neither do we know what kind of pneumonia it is.'
Universities, schools and nurseries have been closed, public meetings have been banned and theatres shut.
The virus from the Ukraine is being tested at the Medical Research council labs in Mill Hill North London.
A spokesman said: 'We do not have a time scale for the results of the tests, although some preliminary results have been obtained. I cannot tell you what they are.
'We did not have enough of the virus samples so we will have to grow some more before we can come to a conclusive decision about its nature.'

Though it should be noted that a few 100's of death amongst 1mn infected indicates that it has a very low virulence, fortunately. Furthermore, Daily Mail isn't usually regarded as a paragon of objective level-headed reporting.

What do you guys make of this?

A History of Human Experimentation on U.S. Citizens?
November 5, 2002

This collection of research leads has NOT been verified by me, Eleanor White. It came from a site which is not a factual source, in my opinion. However, these entries may be important to those researchers among us as starting points for further investigation:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

(1931) Mr. Cornelius Rhoads, under the auspices of the Rockefeller Institute for Medical Investigations, infects human subjects with cancer cells. He later goes on to establish the U.S. Army Biological Warfare facilities in Maryland, Utah, and Panama, and is named to the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission. While there, he begins a series of radiation exposure experiments on American soldiers and civilian hospital patients.

PUBLICLY CONFESSED by President Bill Clinton. (1932)The Tuskegee Syphilis Study begins. 200 black men diagnosed with syphilis are never told of their illness, are denied treatment, and instead are used as human guinea pigs in order to follow the progression and symptoms of the disease. They all subsequently die from syphilis, their families never told that they could have been treated.

(1935) The Pellagra Incident. After millions of individuals die from Pellagra over a span of two decades, the U.S. Public Health Service finally acts to stem the disease. The director of the agency admits it had known for at least 20 years that Pellagra is caused by a niacin deficiency but failed to act since most of the deaths occurred within poverty-stricken black populations.

(1940) Four hundred prisoners in Chicago are infected with Malaria in order to study the effects of new and experimental drugs to combat the disease. Nazi doctors later on trial at Nuremberg cite this American study to defend their own actions during the Holocaust.

(1942) Chemical Warfare Services begins mustard gas experiments on approximately 4,000 servicemen. The experiments continue until 1945 and made use of Seventh Day Adventists who chose to become human guinea pigs rather than serve on active duty.

(1943) In response to Japan's full-scale germ warfare program, the U.S. begins research on biological weapons at Fort Detrick, MD. (1944) U.S. Navy uses human subjects to test gas masks and clothing. Individuals were locked in a gas chamber and exposed to mustard gas and lewisite.

(1945) Project Paperclip is initiated. The U.S. State Department, Army intelligence, and the CIA recruit Nazi scientists and offer them immunity and secret identities in exchange for work on top secret government projects in the United States.

(1945) Program F" is implemented by the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission (AEC)This is the most extensive U.S. study of the health effects of fluoride, which was the key chemical component in atomic bomb production. One of the most toxic chemicals known to man, fluoride, it is found, causes marked adverse effects to the central nervous system but much of the information is squelched in the name of national security because of fear that lawsuits would undermine full-scale production of atomic bombs.

(1946) Patients in VA hospitals are used as guinea pigs for medical experiments. In order to allay suspicions, the order is given to change the word "experiments" to "investigations" or "observations" whenever reporting a medical study performed in one of the nation's veteran's hospitals.

PUBLICLY CONFESSED by President Bill Clinton. (1947) Colonel E.E. Kirkpatrick of the U.S. Atomic Energy Commission issues a secret document (Document 07075001, January 8, 1947) stating that the agency will begin administering intravenous doses of radioactive substances to human subjects.

PUBLICLY REVEALED by U.S. Senate hearings (Church/Inouye). (1947) The CIA begins its study of LSD as a potential weapon for use by American intelligence. Human subjects (both civilian and military) are used with and without their knowledge.

(1950) Department of Defense begins plans to detonate nuclear weapons in desert areas and monitor downwind residents for medical problems and mortality rates.

(1950) In an experiment to determine how susceptible an American city could be to biological attack, the U.S. Navy sprays a cloud of bacteria from ships over San Francisco. Monitoring devices are situated throughout the city in order to test the extent of infection. Many residents become ill with pneumonia-like symptoms.

(1951) Department of Defense begins open air tests using disease-producing bacteria and viruses. Tests last through 1969 and there is concern that people in the surrounding areas have been exposed.

(1953) U.S. military releases clouds of zinc cadmium sulfide gas over Winnipeg, St. Louis, Minneapolis, Fort Wayne, the Monocacy River Valley in Maryland, and Leesburg, Virginia. Their intent is to determine how efficiently they could disperse chemical agents.

(1953) Joint Army-Navy-CIA experiments are conducted in which tens of thousands of people in New York and San Francisco are exposed to the airborne germs Serratia marcescens and Bacillus glogigii.

PUBLICLY REVEALED by U.S. Senate hearings (Church/Inouye). (1953) CIA initiates Project MKULTRA. This is an eleven year research program designed to produce and test drugs and biological agents that would be used for mind control and behavior modification. Six of the subprojects involved testing the agents on unwitting human beings.

(1955) The CIA, in an experiment to test its ability to infect human populations with biological agents, releases a bacteria withdrawn from the Army's biological warfare arsenal over Tampa Bay, Fl.

(1955) Army Chemical Corps continues LSD research, studying its potential use as a chemical incapacitating agent. More than 1,000 Americans participate in the tests, which continue until 1958.

(1956) U.S. military releases mosquitoes infected with Yellow Fever over Savannah, Ga and Avon Park, Fl. Following each test, Army agents posing as public health officials test victims for effects.

(1958) LSD is tested on 95 volunteers at the Army's Chemical Warfare Laboratories for its effect on intelligence.

(1960) The Army Assistant Chief-of-Staff for Intelligence (ACSI) authorizes field testing of LSD in Europe and the Far East. Testing of the European population is code named Project THIRD CHANCE; testing of the Asian population is code named Project DERBY HAT.

(1965) CIA and Department of Defense begin Project MKSEARCH, a program to develop a capability to manipulate human behavior through the use of mind-altering drugs.

(1965) Prisoners at the Holmesburg State Prison in Philadelphia are subjected to dioxin, the highly toxic chemical component of Agent Orange used in Vietnam. The men are later studied for development of cancer, which indicates that Agent Orange had been a suspected carcinogen all along.

(1966) CIA initiates Project MK OFTEN, a program to test the toxicological effects of certain drugs on humans and animals.

(1966) U.S. Army dispenses Bacillus subtilis variant niger throughout the New York City subway system. More than a million civilians are exposed when army scientists drop light bulbs filled with the bacteria onto ventilation grates.

(1967) CIA and Department of Defense implement Project MK NAOMI, successor to MK ULTRA and designed to maintain, stockpile and test biological and chemical weapons.

(1968) CIA experiments with the possibility of poisoning drinking water by injecting chemicals into the water supply of the FDA in Washington, D.C.

(1969) Mr. Robert MacMahan of the Department of Defense requests from congress $10 million to develop, within 5 to 10 years, a synthetic biological agent to which no natural immunity exists.

(1970) Funding for the synthetic biological agent is obtained under H.R. 15090. The project, under the supervision of the CIA, is carried out by the Special Operations Division at Fort Detrick, the army's top secret biological weapons facility. Speculation is raised that molecular biology techniques are used to produce AIDS-like retroviruses.

(1970) United States intensifies its development of ethnic weapons (Military Review, Nov., 1970), designed to selectively target and eliminate specific ethnic groups who are susceptible due to genetic differences and variations in DNA.

(1975) The virus section of Fort Detrick's Center for Biological Warfare Research is renamed the Fredrick Cancer Research Facilities and placed under the supervision of the National Cancer Institute (NCI) . It is here that a special virus cancer program is initiated by the U.S. Navy, purportedly to develop cancer-causing viruses. It is also here that retro virologists isolate a virus to which no immunity exists. It is later named HTLV (Human T-cell Leukemia Virus).

(1977) Senate hearings on Health and Scientific Research confirm that 239 populated areas had been contaminated with biological agents between 1949 and 1969. Some of the areas included San Francisco, Washington, D.C., Key West, Panama City, Minneapolis, and St. Louis.

(1978) Experimental Hepatitis B vaccine trials, conducted by the CDC, begin in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco. Ads for research subjects specifically ask for promiscuous homosexual men.

(1981) First cases of AIDS are confirmed in homosexual men in New York, Los Angeles and San Francisco, triggering speculation that AIDS may have been introduced via the Hepatitis B vaccine.

(1985) According to the journal Science (227:173-177), HTLV and VISNA, a fatal sheep virus, are very similar, indicating a close taxonomic and evolutionary relationship.

(1986) According to the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (83:4007-4011), HIV and VISNA are highly similar and share all structural elements, except for a small segment which is nearly identical to HTLV. This leads to speculation that HTLV and VISNA may have been linked to produce a new retrovirus to which no natural immunity exists.

(1986) A report to Congress reveals that the U.S. Government's current generation of biological agents includes: modified viruses, naturally occurring toxins, and agents that are altered through genetic engineering to change immunological character and prevent treatment by all existing vaccines.

(1987) Department of Defense admits that, despite a treaty banning research and development of biological agents, it continues to operate research facilities at 127 facilities and universities around the nation.

(1990) More than 1500 six-month old black and Hispanic babies in Los Angeles are given an "experimental" measles vaccine that had never been licensed for use in the United States. CDC later admits that parents were never informed that the vaccine being injected to their children was experimental.

(1994) With a technique called "gene tracking," Dr. Garth Nicolson at the MD. Anderson Cancer Center in Houston, TX discovers that many returning Desert Storm veterans are infected with an altered strain of Mycoplasma incognitus, a microbe commonly used in the production of biological weapons. Incorporated into its molecular structure is 40 percent of the HIV protein coat, indicating that it had been man- made.

(1994) Senator John D. Rockefeller issues a report revealing that for at least 50 years the Department of Defense has used hundreds of thousands of military personnel in human experiments and for intentional exposure to dangerous substances. Materials included mustard and nerve gas, ionizing radiation, psycho chemicals, hallucinogens, and drugs used during the Gulf War.

(1995) U.S. Government admits that it had offered Japanese war criminals and scientists who had performed human medical experiments salaries and immunity from prosecution in exchange for data on biological warfare research.

(1995) Dr. Garth Nicolson, uncovers evidence that the biological agents used during the Gulf War had been manufactured in Houston, TX. and Boca Raton, Fl. and tested on prisoners in the Texas Department of Corrections.

(1996) Department of Defense admits that Desert Storm soldiers were exposed to chemical agents.

(1997) Eighty-eight members of Congress sign a letter demanding an investigation into bio weapons use & Gulf War Syndrome.

On the 3rd October 1995 ,President Clinton publicly apologized to the thousands of people who became victims of MK ULTRA and other mind-control experimental programs - is an apology good enough?.

http://www.raven1.net/humexper.htm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ySw-0uY4CUA

Though normally I would dismiss this, as of now it is looking pretty dodgy. The timing is certainly opportune in the extreme, - what with elections slated for January 2010, a new gas war brewing, the IMF threatening to withdraw support due to economic mismanagement, and Yushenko even writing to the US & NATO to help fight the virus "threatening the nation's internal security" - wtf?! Will comment more later.

@Martin

How we don't know what this bio-weapon is designed to do and it has been rumoured for years that Israel has been developing genetic weapons.

It might only be designed to attack a specific small percentage of the population enough to postpone the election and bring in NATO troops for "assistance" inside the country.

It is odd that it is located in the western hemisphere. I wonder if the outbreak of the flu is located near any military bases or airports.

It's not about Ukraine it’s about manoeuvres against Russia.

Influenza pandemics are natural events.
However if it happened for this particular strain present on Ukraine to be a biowapon, then it is a pretty crap one.
In any case NATO has no business on Ukraine at the moment, unless their idea is to reignite eternal civil war there which was going on for last 800 years with few short breaks.

I don't like to reference the http://www.rense.com/ website but there has been talk about the swine flu in Ukraine being a bio-weapon about an alleged Israeli microbiologist who allegedly 3 months ago warned that Baxter’s International was creating a biological weapon to be distributed via vaccine in Ukraine.

Has Baxter Released A BioWeapon In Ukraine?
By David Rothscum
11-2-9

Evidence appears to suggest that Baxter International may be responsible for a new deadly outbreak of viral pneumonia in Ukraine.

(http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aTo3LbhcA75I) In February of 2009, Bloomberg reported that Baxter "accidentally" sent vaccine material containing both live Avian bird flu and seasonal influenza to multiple laboratories worldwide. A laboratory decided to test the vaccine on its ferrets and the ferrets all unexpectedly died.

(http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aTo3LbhcA75I) http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=aTo3LbhcA75I

It must be noted that Baxter has made a "mistake" like this before. (http://www.aegis.com/news/re/1996/RE960283.html) Blood products produced by Baxter once containd HIV. Thousands of haemophiliacs died due to this, and many went on to infect their spouses.

http://www.aegis.com/news/re/1996/RE960283.html

Later in the year, a bizarre story emerged on the internet. The news was full of reports on (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/14/man-suspected-of-making-t_n_259330.html) a man named Joseph Moshe who was arrested after a hours long standoff with the police because he had supposedly made threats against the White House. The man was able to withstand multiple rounds of tear gas...which left L.A. police officers amazed.

However, the internet community was very skeptical of the true reasons behind the man's arrest. Comments on the Huffington Post website immediately began pouring in about an unreported side to this story, namely that Joseph Moshe was a Mossad Agent who specialized in biological warfare and who called into a radio show to warn people about a biological weapn that was being made by Baxter international that would be spread through vaccine and would cause a plague upon its release.

Although anyone can make a doomsday claim and we should never believe anyone (and it must be said that the Truth movement handled this well, the message was spread without being proclaimed as gospel) the amazing part about Moshe's claim was the location where Moshe said the biological weapon was being produced.

Moshe claimed that Baxter's laboratory in the Ukraine out of all places was creating this biological weapon. All of this came out in the beginning of August, which is more than 2 months before the situation that is currently unfolding. For Moshe to correctly name the country where a new epidemic would be unleashed, requires either inside information, or an incredible coincidence as anyone with a basic knowledge of statistics can confirm for himself.

Let us assume for a moment that every person on our planet has an equal chance of giving rise to a new lethal epidemic due to a virus that mutates as it spreads through his body. (http://www.ukrstat.gov.ua/operativ/operativ2009/ds/kn/kn_e/kn0609_e.html)

(http://www.ukrstat.gov.ua/operativ/operativ2009/ds/kn/kn_e/kn0609_e.html) Ukraine has 46 million inhabitants. (http://www.census.gov/ipc/www/popclockworld.html) The current estimated global population is about 6.7 billion. This means that if a new epidemic were to arise, the chance of this epidemic starting in the Ukraine would be 0.69%. (http://zik.com.ua/en/news/2009/10/29/202374) However, it appears that this virus is a form of flu. This makes the odds of being right when guessing that a deadly flu is going to break out in the Ukraine even smaller. The reason for this is that back in early August the vast majority of influenza infections were found in different countries than the Ukraine. (http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/292540,
ukraine-confirms-first-swine-flu-death-quarantine-ordered.html) In fact, on 30 Oktober, Earthtimes reported that Ukraine had officially reported only two cases of swine flu, and no deaths, until last Friday. This deadly epidemic appears to have arrived out of nowhere in the Ukraine.
(http://www.biomedexperts.com/Profile.bme/78637/Moshe_Bar-Joseph)

(http://www.biomedexperts.com/Profile.bme/78637/Moshe_Bar-Joseph) Moshe's biomed profile appears to confirm his position as a microbiologist. Furthermore, this page with Baxter's contact information for its Ukraine office confirms that Baxter has a presence in the Ukraine.

http://www.biomedexperts.com/Profile.bme/78637/Moshe_Bar-Joseph

(http://www.stevequayle.com/dead_scientists/UpdatedDeadScientists.html) It must also be noted that massive numbers of microbiologists have been dying bizarre deaths. This case of what appears to be a brave man who sacrificed it all to bring us this message may explain why so many microbiologists have been murdered. The fact that this man managed to predict an outbreak of highly lethal influenza in a place where we would least expect it, 2 months before it a actually occured, lends credence to his claim that Baxter International is responsible for the outbreak and shows that top microbiologists can pose a problem to the people responsible for this ongoing disaster.

This is a developing story, expect to see possible updates on David Rothscum Reports as more information on what is happening in Ukraine becomes available.

Update 1: For the purpose of keeping information from disappearing, I am going to mirror most information I can find on here.

Comments on the Huffington post website on an article about Moshe's arrest documenting his claim that the Influenza virus in a vaccine manufactured by Baxter in Ukraine replicates RNA from the 1918 flu and is meant as a bioweapon:

(http://www.infowars.com/images/josephmosheukraine.JPG)

Update 2: (http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/article/ALeqM5jlasqqSlUIt56rnsbgDSaDdjU9kw) The Ukrainian government wants to impose travel restrictions on people across the nation to stop the virus from spreading.

Update 3: According to the Huffington post comments I cited above, Dr. Moshe claimed that the virus used replicated RNA of the 1918 Spanish flu. (http://www.history.navy.mil/library/online/influenza%
20phil%201918.htm) Symptoms of the 1919 Flu include victims being drenched in blood:

American were familiar with the flu; it sent you to bed, made you miserable for 3 or 4 days with fever, muscle aches, and congestion, then left you shaky for about a week. It made millions sick, yet killed only the oldest, youngest, and most feeble.

The 1918 influenza was not the flu Americans were familiar with. It was a horror that turned victims bluish-black then drowned them with their own body fluids. the death toll was highest in the ages 15 to 40, those in the peak of health. The victims would be fine one minute and the next incapacitated, fever-racked, and delirious. Temperatures rose to 104-106 degrees, skin turned blue, purple, or deep brown from lack of oxygen. Massive pneumonia attacked the lungs, filling them with fluid; blood gushed from the nose. Death was quick, savage, and terrifying.

(http://zik.com.ua/en/news/2009/10/29/202374) Compare this to reports that are coming out from Ukraine:

Five persons have died from the flue in Lviv, four men and one woman, says emergency hospital chief doctor Myron Borysevych.

Two of the dead patients were in the 22-35 age group, with 2 others over 60. He diagnosed the disease as viral pneumonia.

Viral tests can last from one to two weeks. They are complicated and not done in Lviv. The course of the disease was very quick. The symptoms included very high temperature and short-wind cough.

All the six dead young people had symptoms of severe hemmorhagic pneumonia. The disease starts slowly, with temperature rising to 37.2 ­ 37.3 degrees, slight cough and pain in joints. Nasal catarrh developed at the end of the second or third day. Autopsy revealed that the lungs were soaked with blood, the oblast chief specialist said.

http://www.rense.com/general88/bax.htm

Also covered in another website.

Three months ago, Israeli Mossad agent Joseph Moshe, who specializes in biological warfare, was taken down by Los Angeles police, allegedly for "threatening the White House." What wasn't reported by the media at the time was that Moshe just had "called into a radio show to warn people about a biological weapon that was being made by Baxter international that would be spread through vaccine and would cause a plague upon its release." (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/08/14/man-suspected-of-making-t_n_259330.html) Moshe also claimed that Ukraine would be the country in which it first would be released. This was in early August. How did he know?

Three months ago, Moshe stated that this pandemic would begin in Ukraine, a country free of the flu until last week. That is too much for coincidence. Maybe it simply is coincidence, but I do not believe in coincidence. And, suddenly, lots of people are dying in Ukraine from this flu outbreak - a much more deadly form of the flu than has been seen anywhere else.

Baxter Pharmaceuticals has a vaccine development and production lab in Ukraine and in the past has been proven to have shipped dangerous live agents to other countries, notably AIDS in blood products that killed thousands of people a few years ago. This past spring, Czechoslovakia happened to test some Baxter vaccine and found live virus, something about which you may have heard.

Baxter, the source of the flu vaccine now being distributed over there, cannot be trusted! The Ukrainian people are not being told any of this or about what this Moshe character said just prior to being arrested in August over here.
http://www.nickelrant.com/rants/091103rant.htm

http://www.nickelrant.com/rants/091103rant.htm

Interesting to see if Wayne Madsen at RT covers the story.

This would give the US/NATO perfect excuse and there Orange regime cover to impose Martial law, postpone the election (which they are sure to lose) and bring in NATO/US troops into the country and a cover in training NATO force in an area with biological contaminant as I believe I have mentioned before Chechen and other Islamic militants have been trained in camps in Afghanistan and Panski Gorge to develop chemical and biological weapons. It was even referenced in Colin Powell’s speech to the UN indicating connections to Iraq and international terrorism.